Judge Duncan M. Beagle Part One

Arthur Busch 0:09

Our guest today is Genesee County Circuit Court Judge Duncan M. Beagle. Duncan Beagle is a third-generation attorney and now judge. His grandfather, Charles Beagle, was the Genesee County prosecutor in the 1920s. His father, John Beagle, practiced law over 50 years in Genesee County, was generally considered to be one of the best domestic relations attorney the county had ever seen. Both his grandfather and his father, John, served as assistant prosecutors in the Tennessee County Prosecutor's Office. Duncan Beagle also had that privilege. He has been serving on the Tennessee County Circuit Court bench since 1991. He received his undergraduate degree from Albion College in 1970 and his jurisdictorate degree from Detroit Mercy in 1975. Prior to his election to the Tennessee County Circuit Court, he had been a court administrator in the 67th District Court, served five years, as I said, in the prosecutor's office. He was a friend of the court referee for over four years, and he spent nine years practicing domestic relations and criminal law private practice. Duncan Beagle has received many accolades in the community, including by the State Bar of Michigan as a champion for justice. Because of the import of these of this family, the Beagle family, I thought we'd break this up into two episodes because there's so much to cover with uh Duncan, with his family history and his many accomplishments as well. So the first episode will focus on Duncan and his upbringing in Flint. We'll talk about his love for sports, uh, and uh we'll talk about some of his accomplishments and projects on the bench today. Without any further ado, here is Duncan Beagle. Okay, this is Radio Free Flint. This is Arthur Bush, and today's guest, I have Judge Duncan M. Beagle. The M stands for McLaren.

SPEAKER_01 2:36

Well, it's a pleasure, Art. I don't know how many uh people I'd be talking to on Easter morning, but uh we go way back, so it's my pleasure as well.

Arthur Busch 2:44

You are a Flint native and you attended Flint schools.

SPEAKER_01 2:48

Junior high at Flint Southwestern High School. In fact, I remember running into Bill Ballinger one day, and we were talking about where we went to school, and he said, Where'd you go to school? I said, I went to Zimmerman. In fact, I still remember the fight song, Zimmerman Clippers will fight for you onward to victory for the golden blue. And he looked at me and he said, You are one strange guy, but I still remember that song.

Arthur Busch 3:15

Were you the star of the basketball team there?

SPEAKER_01 3:18

Oh, I was one of the players as well. You know, we uh we were okay, we were mediocre about a 500 team.

Arthur Busch 3:24

You were raised in the city of Flint, yep, right on Miller Road, and then you went on to Southwestern High School, my alma mater as well. At Southwestern, where you play you played sports at Southwestern, uh football, basketball, and baseball. What sport do you think you were best at?

SPEAKER_01 3:43

Baseball, because that's what I went on and played in college.

Arthur Busch 3:45

You graduated with some pretty interesting and successful people in your class. Tell us about a few of those guys.

SPEAKER_01 3:53

Yeah, you know, uh, we lived at the south end of the county, and as you well know, there was a lot of middle class and upper middle class families, or a lot of a lot of prominent families that live over off of Miller Road on Parkside Drive, Westward Drive, Hawthorne. Uh, one of my close friends was Tom Scaff, who uh whose family's been in the furniture carpet business for well over a hundred years, trying to think of other prominent people. Uh the postmaster at that time was a guy by the name of Schwartz, and his daughter uh and I were best of friends. So uh yeah, a lot of really good families that lived in that area. And I had a paper out on Mellow Road that was right between Chelsea Circle and Lincoln Drive. And some of the interesting people I met, not only did I went to school with, but the former mayor of Flint, I think was Oz Kelly and one of Flint's greatest lawyers, uh, Walt Crapel, you know, 10, 11, 12 years old, you didn't appreciate uh who these prominent people were, but it was a great neighborhood to live in back in those days.

Arthur Busch 4:57

And Flint was inviting it. Did it have the community school concept when you were going to school at Zimmerman?

SPEAKER_01 5:05

Yeah, they did. I think I don't know that we fully appreciated it that. I can remember being at Southwestern High School, and after we'd be done with practice, I remembered some of these adults coming in for classes. And I had no idea really what it was, other than people were coming in the building to you know get further educated. It was only later in life that you realized uh how lucky we were, because as you well know, people from around not only the country, from around the world came in to learn about community education, and uh it all started here in Flint, Michigan. I sometimes I'll go out when I'm talking to different groups, and I said, listen, Flint's got to be the comeback city. I said, We ought, we should all have a goal that if you want to know how to rebuild an old industrial city, go to Flint, Michigan. That's how people came to Flint. A lot of people to visit us in the old days was to learn about community education. So yeah, we were very fortunate.

Arthur Busch 5:58

Part of that community education concept involved not just making a school uh centered around the kids, but actually the whole community. It was sort of a community-building project as well.

SPEAKER_01 6:12

It really was, uh, as you well know. Flint schools were open from seven o'clock in the morning until probably 10 o'clock at night. It was amazing.

Arthur Busch 6:20

You know, I've talked to many people uh over the past year about Flint, uh, many of them from places across the country. The expatriates of Flint have a strong affinity to the community, and the people in Flint also uh have that same affinity. What extent do you think the community schools helped to drive that? People have very fond memories of these this period of time when the schools catered to the community and families and had ice cream socials and so forth.

SPEAKER_01 6:52

Yeah, you know, you're right. Uh it was a sense of real community. I know, for example, in sports, uh, at a younger age, you'd be involved in mod football or mod basketball or something. And you were you realize that you were very fortunate to live in a community with uh with a foundation that helps so many people. But it but you're right, it goes beyond that. There was a certain amount of pride. I don't know whether it's because we were building the you know the best automobiles in the world, maybe there were other factors. We certainly had uh tremendous athletic teams, a lot of a lot of folks in the community uh were aware of. And it was a good cross-section of people. There were so many people that moved to Flint from different parts of the country. When we were united, uh, yeah, you were very, very proud to be from Flint, Michigan, no question about it.

Arthur Busch 7:39

One of the things uh Sandra Branch mentioned to me the other day, who's the lady from the Flint Public Art Project that's done all those fabulous murals around town, is she felt that one of the strengths of Flint was its actual diversity. How do you see that? It seems like it's a town that had a lot of cultures being blended and molded into one, you know, at least during the 50s, 60s, and most of the 70s.

SPEAKER_01 8:07

No, I agree. Uh, you and I have talked to people that grew up in the north end of Flint, and this was before a lot of the minorities came from uh some of the southern states. But there was such a, like you said, so much diversity that went around the uh community. And again, I think a lot of that's due to uh where people came from, because people were looking for employment, they came to uh Flint, Michigan. And you're right, it was a hodgepodge of people of different uh nationalities. To go back and look at your beer books from probably the uh 40s and 50s when uh minorities came up. When you look at some of your sports teams uh started out, there were a few, but and then we had those great, great uh rivalries when there was only two schools in town, Flint Central and Flint Northern. And there was so much pride that went into the Thanksgiving Day game in Flint, Michigan, that nobody had dinner in Flint until after the football game was over. And you would pack that stadium with people from all over the community, the north end, the south side, the west side, the east side. So it was really probably the 40s, 50s, and 60s was just a tremendous time to live in Flint, Michigan.

Arthur Busch 9:16

A part of that good feeling, or I call it affinity, I guess that's what social scientists would say. It's an affinity to uh to a geographic community. Uh that affinity still exists today, even though people are stretched across the country and have raised families in other places. How do you explain that?

SPEAKER_01 9:38

Uh, you know, that's an excellent question. Uh, I think there's a lot to be proud of uh from Flint. I mean, let's be honest, we all know we've got one of the finest cultural centers. We've got a really nice airport that we can all be proud of. We've got uh two universities, University of Michigan, Kettering University, well respected. We've got Mott Community College, it's a very well-respected uh community college. And I think there's so many things in Flint uh historically to be proud of. I I don't know if you've been in my courtroom, uh, but I've got a mural. And when we uh we totally renovated uh some of the courtrooms back uh when we added a part to the courthouse, and the theme in my courtroom is the uh takeoff of the automobile industry in the early 1900s. And you will see a mural that was done by a gentleman by the name of Davidson, he's passed away. But we've got within the mural, we've got several of the auto pioneers, the Billy Durance, the Mott's, the Buick's, the Chevrolets. And I'll sit there and watch people that are watching a trial or whatever, and they'll stare at that mural for an hour, two hours, because I realize there's so much there. There's a portion that's dedicated to sit-down strike, is uh, as you know, back in I think the mid-30s. And it's just uh just an incredible time to live in Flint, Michigan, even though you know we're kind of on uh uh, you know, let's be honest, we were kind of rebuilding ourselves, kind of adjusting to the unemployment. And then the water crisis hit and that uh drove us back. But I think you're right. I I just like your show right now, I don't doubt you probably get a lot of people that probably have retired or moved on to other states that tune into your show. And I think there is so much pride because they realized the the city that they were living in in the time was one of the hotbeds in the entire country. There was so much activity, so many positive good things that are going on. Great time to live in Flint.

Arthur Busch 11:36

By the way, the show only about half of the people listen to this are from are you know are are in Michigan, the rest are all over the United States, and then six this show went to 16 countries last year, and there is an increasing amount of international interest in in Flint. Duncan, you know, you're a sports junkie, would you admit that?

SPEAKER_01 12:00

I'm a sports junkie.

Arthur Busch 12:03

Where'd that come from?

SPEAKER_01 12:05

You know, it's a good question. Uh my dad was never all that interested in sports to some degree, but not like I am, nor was my mother. I don't know. I guess it was something I was good at at a young age and carried over. And I had some uh outstanding coaches that perhaps uh motivated me. I don't know, but it's I can't really put my finger on it, but I just know it's something I always enjoyed growing up and still do today.

Arthur Busch 12:30

Well, the first time I ever saw you was at Lincoln Park, and you were you were at Lincoln Park in the in the south end of Flint, and you're on the mound, and you were throwing curveballs. And I think I remember you were left-handed. I I think it was left-handed.

SPEAKER_01 12:54

Right hand.

Arthur Busch 12:55

Right hand. Well, I remember the curveballs uh because I was a kid at that time and I couldn't figure out how to hit a curveball to save my life. You figured out how to throw one that baffled uh the hitters.

SPEAKER_01 13:09

You know, one interesting thing, and I didn't even know this, but when Atwood Stadium closed down to baseball in uh I think the mid-60s, uh most of the uh recreational baseball was over at Broom Park over off of Atherton Road. And I did not realize it at the time, but uh uh they opened up Broom Park about the middle of June, and I played and pitched in the first baseball game ever played at Broome Park. We were victorious. I was playing for Genesee Tools. I didn't even know that until Len Hoy's a journal writer, several years later, reminded me.

Arthur Busch 13:44

Now you went on to Albion College and became uh a baseball phenomenon uh over there. And in fact, my research tells me that you're in the hall of fame of your of your college for athletics.

SPEAKER_01 14:01

Yeah, I uh played baseball. I went out for football my freshman year, but when I walked in for the first uh meeting, the coach didn't remember my name and didn't know where I was from, and I thought it was the biggest mistake I'd ever made. And then I got on the Jabofer squad who ran the other team's plays and practice. And you used to get the H E L L beat out of you every single practice. So I finally decided uh perhaps I should devote my time and energy to something I enjoyed a little bit more, which was the great game of baseball.

Arthur Busch 14:32

Well, and you you finished your career there with a flourish. That tell us that story.

SPEAKER_01 14:38

Going to school, I graduated in 1970, which was uh right around the peak of the Vietnam War. It was a really difficult time because uh we had the lottery in February of that year, and you knew if you drew a low number, you were probably gonna get drafted. And that was when the war had changed, that uh a lot of young people were very much against the war. And so I drew the number 157, and I knew there was a pretty good chance I was gonna get drafted. So I had one month left in my athletic career, and I think my time and energy went into uh just finishing as strong as I could possibly do so. So I was able to win my last four games and of course pitch a one hitter against Michigan State, and then several months later had to go on to a military duty. So I I think that uh that focus, recognizing how how much your life is going to change, uh uh got me to appreciate four years at Albion. And and in fact, it's interesting. I don't know if I ever told you this. Uh Robert Griffin, who was the uh United States Senator, was our keynote speaker at the time. My dad and I uh met for a cold one before graduation, and I had a red armband on my uh graduation robe, and he said, What the hell is that? And I said, Well, we're protesting the war. And he goes, You mean to tell me you're gonna wear that during graduation? He goes, Yeah. He goes, The hell you are. Well, then mixed emotions came through me that here's a guy, my mom and dad had supported me through four years of college, and my my independence of wanting to stand up for something I believed in. So finally I challenged to him uh a game of an eight ball pool table. And I was having a game of my life, he was a better pool player, and uh, he had three balls left on the table, and I had one, and I was so excited the Drenwell was flowing, and I knocked that ball in the pocket pocket, except the uh cue ball kept backing up and ended up in the pocket. And I still remember to this day my dad yelling over to the bartender bartender, bring over a pair of scissors and cut this red armband off this young man's throat. A couple of my other colleagues, uh uh Jeff Netherkitt and Randy Piper, who graduated with me, they wore theirs and uh stood up, but I stayed seated. And it was probably the better thing to do. But uh many of my classmates turned their back on Robert Griffin because of the war.

Arthur Busch 17:05

You went to school with Jeff Netherkitt at at Albion?

SPEAKER_01 17:09

Yep, we uh graduated and Randy Piper as well.

Arthur Busch 17:12

And later and later you and Jeff uh sat together uh as colleagues on the Genesee County Circuit Court.

SPEAKER_01 17:21

That's correct. Good friend. Good friend.

Arthur Busch 17:25

A lot could be said about your athletic career, but uh that had to come to an end. But uh you continued your interest in sports and your activity with uh athletics well after you graduated from college. Give us a sense of some of the things that you accomplished in that in that area and what were your what what kinds of fun things did you do playing uh you know, taking up your your passion, if you will, uh in the Flint community.

SPEAKER_01 17:53

Well, a couple things uh came to mind. Of course, if uh if you had played sports, uh my mentor, my second father, Tom Yotis, would find you, and you had to be a participant on the lawyers softball team. And so we had the likes of uh Tim Bogracus and uh Denny Lazar and Sam Ragnone and anybody that looked like they're an athlete, uh you would get a call from the judge. And even if you didn't feel like playing softball, you kind of felt an obligation to uh father Tom. So uh we had some great lawyer softball teams back in that time, and I had a coach at uh Lbion College, uh Morley Frazier, that got me into sports officiating. And so for about 20, 25 years until I came down with my physical issue, I officiated uh high school basketball, which was really, really fun because it got you around, you got to meet a lot of the community, and and I wish I'd had more time to perhaps uh to have done that, maybe uh done some football and baseball, but uh time didn't permit it. But definitely enjoyed. And of course, as you well know, I got involved in the Atwood Stadium uh project. Make sure we restored that beautiful historical facility. So those three things I think have uh kept me active with sports.

Arthur Busch 19:05

Officiating uh Saginaw Valley basketball games requires a certain amount of uh physical conditioning.

SPEAKER_01 19:14

No question about that.

Arthur Busch 19:16

You were running with the dogs when you were doing that.

SPEAKER_01 19:19

There's no doubt about it. Uh, you know, really teams back at that time were so highly skilled, it's hard to believe, but they were easier games to officiate it because the skill level was so good. You had to make some tough calls. Uh, teams were so fundamentally sound, it was as much fun to watching the game as it was officiating it.

Arthur Busch 19:39

Duncan, you've helped a lot of kids and mentored a lot of kids along the way, especially athletes. Some of the more memorable ones for our entire community. I mean, we have all our favorites, and we've all had, you know, some great moments watching uh high school athletics. But we had a crew in 2000 that uh played for who I think is one of the greatest coaches in the history of the college game, Tom Izzo. And we had four young men that went down to Michigan State and played for Izzo. You knew those people.

SPEAKER_01 20:16

You know, it's funny. I uh when I was a practicing lawyer, I sponsored some uh uh youth teams, and we called them the legal Beagles. We had a Beagle dog in the front of their shirts, but one of the teams I sponsored just happened to have a 11-year-old kid by the name of Mateen Cleves, and one of his friends by the name of Robert Smith, who ended up in the National Football League. And as a result of that, I got to uh know those folks. There was Robert's brother, Antonio Smith. There was Charlie Bell, who went to Southwestern, of course, Morris Peterson, whose father was in education. And I think one of the best memories I have is not only following those guys all that year and the tremendous pride they gave to the community, but at the spur of the moment, I got two guys and we went down to uh Indianapolis for the national championship game, not knowing whether we would get any tickets or not. We were able to get tickets. We uh went to the game and I couldn't sleep. The next morning I went down to the hotel lobby where somebody had given us a room. And the first person I ran into was Tom Izzo about six o'clock in the morning because he was going to do all the morning uh talk show. Uh, had a chance to talk to him for about 10 minutes, and uh, it was just one of those great memories where Flint was just being highlighted. You were very, very proud of those four young men from Flint, Michigan.

Arthur Busch 21:36

Those guys became known as the Flintstones. Where did that come from? People called themselves Flinttoids, I remember.

SPEAKER_01 21:45

Yeah.

Arthur Busch 21:46

And Flintstones, I don't know, I don't remember it before then. Do you?

SPEAKER_01 21:50

Um, I it may have come from the cartoon character, and I can still remember somebody around town that uh did a sketch of uh. The Flintstones and incorporated uh our four basketball players into it. I don't know if that's exactly where it came from, but as you well know, there's stories that go around the community. But what a great nickname! Because uh people still talk about that when they uh uh when they talk about the history of basketball, especially college basketball. They'll go back to 2000 and uh those four young men from Flint, Michigan. In fact, you may remember this because I think you were the prosecutor at the time. Ted Copel was doing a show related to that story out of Beecher where the young man had uh young kid had taken a pistol and shot a girl, and it got a lot of notoriety. And as I recall traveling back from the national championship game, they were trying to get a hold of you, as I recall, and somehow they tracked me down because I had sentenced the father of the young uh the youth when the media came through town. They just happened to have my number, you know. I hadn't shaved or cleaned up or anything. They said, Well, you want to do a show with Ted Coppel? And I said, Well, what do I have to do? They said, Well, we're on a time deadline. Can you go to your local studio, uh WJRT in Flint? And I said, Well, yeah, but I haven't cleaned up or anything. He said, Well, that's all right, don't worry about it. So I go over to WJRT, and the next thing I know, this was before they started the interview. I'm talking to my hero Ted Coppel. You may have had uh chance to speak with him, and what a warm, friendly guy. And Flint was getting the bad publicity out of that Mulmore shooting, the tragedy. I said to Mr. Coppel, I said, Mr. Coppel, I said, Flint's getting a bad rap these days. Any way you can incorporate that basketball game from last night with our Flintstones? And he chuckled and he goes, You know, I'd love to. I watched that game, but he said, This thing is really scripted, I just don't think we can. And to this day, I still can't remember what Ted Koppel asked me or what I said. I just know it was one of those memories that it was the day following the national championship.

Arthur Busch 24:00

I've forgotten that you did that show because I watched it, and I had participated in uh various interviews with with Ted Koppel, including Ted Koppel telling me if I'm ever in Washington to call him, which somehow they found out I was coming to Washington and invited me to their studio.

SPEAKER_01 24:24

Good guy. I really like Ted Koppel.

Arthur Busch 24:26

And I interviewed with Ted Koppel that day, uh that evening in his studio in Washington, DC, and I got to know him, and he gave me a tour of this of the studio. Um the words that you used in that case were so prophetic, they were so incisive, it's insightful into the community that I've given some thought to to uh making sure that the public doesn't forget that. Uh uh, you know, not only uh that incident which broke everybody's heart in Flint and and across the country, there were a lot of lessons to be learned from that case that that came across our desks. Let me go back to the Flintstones on a more lighter note. Those guys they represented something uh to the people of Michigan and especially to Flint. What was that that you think they represented?

SPEAKER_01 25:26

You know, the interesting thing, there were four high schools in the community at that time. And uh, as I recall, I think they attended three out of the four high schools. Uh, so the entire community uh from each of those schools uh really took a lot of pride. As I recall, I think two of them had educators in their family. I think Charlie Bell and uh and Morris Peterson. Mateen Cleves had uh father and mother that were well known around town. So I just uh it was one of those things I think we latched on to. Uh the other thing, you know, when you think about Flint historically, it was a work hard, play hard type community, a lot of blue-collar people. And that's the way those guys played the game. Uh, if you knew anything at all about Mateen Cleves, boy, I'll tell you what, he was just a born natural leader. He didn't become successful in the NBA, but in terms of a leader, you wouldn't have found a better one than Mateen Cleves.

Arthur Busch 26:20

Yeah, well, he he was the number one draft pick. Uh yeah. And that's that's so bad. Toughness and the uh strength that they represented and the determination uh came to represent to the people of Flint exactly what it means to be a Flintstone, not just on a basketball court, but in life.

SPEAKER_01 26:42

I'll tell you one other thing. I'm uh talking to some of the coaches and athletic directors, and we're going to try and create a Flintstone classic uh for the beginning of uh high school basketball and see if there's any interest. And one of the reasons for it is to keep that uh uh that history alive. So a lot of young people realize uh what these gentlemen were all about.

Arthur Busch 27:01

What I've also experienced doing this podcast and talking to as many people as I have is that there are people now that refer to themselves as flintstones.

SPEAKER_01 27:10

I think that's true.

Arthur Busch 27:12

It's trans it's transcended sports. I think it has. What's it mean to be a flintstone? That's a good question. In a bigger sense of the word. What what is it that a flintstone means? And let me start out by asking, are you a flintstone?

SPEAKER_01 27:29

Absolutely. I think it's uh pride in your community, hard work, because every one of those guys worked at their trade and they all became uh successful. But I think it was their style of play, they were dedicated to their family and community, and they represented a community that they just knew how to, you know. If you remember the Pistons, I think they had that uh image with Ben Wallace and uh uh Lamb Beer and some of those guys about that uh bring your lunch bucket and it's time to go to work. And I think all of them came from working families, and uh, I think a lot of people in Flint, you know, certainly recognize that.

Arthur Busch 28:08

Your involvement in the Flint community has been uh absolutely unparalleled in terms of its uh effect. Uh you're not just a judge, you you've taken the role of community leader, and and uh that started way before you were ever uh put on the bench by uh Governor John Engler. You have received, I mean, obviously you've been given a lot of accolades for your efforts, but starting way back, you had an interest in helping young people and kids, especially through uh various programs, including the Big Brothers, Big Sisters program. How did you get interested in that program? What role did you play? And are you still involved?

SPEAKER_01 28:55

Yeah, one of my closest friends uh who went to LB in college with me was a guy that anybody around the Flint area remember, he's passed away, was Gary Hagart. And uh Gary knew that I liked young people and uh and he got me involved uh when I came back uh from law school and uh ended up with four little brothers over the years, was involved in a lot of their activities, their bowling events and so forth. And it was uh of all the boards that I've ever been on, uh, that one was easily the most fun. It was upbeat, uh went into the community, gave speeches, you were dealing with young people all the time. Uh, but a lot of that the credit goes to uh Gary Hager, no question about it.

Arthur Busch 29:36

Yeah, no, at one time I think you told me that you had, I forget how many little brothers. I mean, they as you were working with them, they grew up, and then some somehow I thought you you continued to serve as a big brother.

SPEAKER_01 29:52

Yeah, I think uh kind of an informal little brother right now, who uh community knows this was a young man by the name of Willie McQueen who played high school football with no legs. And I read about the story, and he went to Southwestern, and I was bound to determine I was going to uh locate him. And I found out that he lived over behind uh Hurley Hospital, and I've got the address, and there were tennis shoes hanging over the electrical wires when I was going down the street. I finally found the house, and he came out at the age of 14 in his wheelchair, and we met, and uh it took a while to really get to know him. But uh, I'll tell you what, I to this day, for a young man just to say he wants to be one of the guys to play high school football on the defensive line, he and I he's like a second son to me uh to this day. We talk to each other at least uh once a week, and he's really my inspiration because uh anybody who uh I've never one time heard the kid complain, but I think being around young people like that can teach uh teach us all a lesson. He certainly taught me and many others a big lesson.

Arthur Busch 31:02

You also have been involved in other activities in the community. Can you tell us about some of those other things that you've done without being so modest?

SPEAKER_01 31:12

Well, I've been involved in a lot of uh boards and organizations, and uh I I think uh a lot of times people get recruited to be on boards. And I found out that besides our legal activities, a lot of the boards and committees and things like that, be involved in something you really enjoy. So I think anything that's been sports related or youth related, I've been involved in a number of those kinds of activities. I'm still on the board of the greater uh Flint Baseball and Softball. Uh, still involve myself with Big Brothers and Big Sisters as much as I can. But anything that's uh kind of youth oriented, I try and uh get involved in because that's where my passion is. I encourage a lot of people that if you want to get to know your community, certainly serve on at least a couple boards and still an active member in our service club, the Flint Rotary Club. I backed off a little bit because my wife tells me I'm better off uh trying to enjoy a little time at home, but still enjoy giving back to my community.

Arthur Busch 32:11

And you've also been involved one way or another with these various sports hall of fame that exist in Flint. Have you ever served on the boards of any of those?

SPEAKER_01 32:20

Yeah, I'm on the uh board still of the Greater Flint Area Sports Hall of Fame and uh served as president one year, but but that's uh that's been fun because it's always good to look back at your history. I'm very close friends with Norm Bryant, who likewise is into their black history here in Genesee County, and we'll compare notes all the time, and he'll educate me about the old days back in the uh the 40s and 50s, and it's always fun sitting around listening to he and Tom Yotis talk about how life was uh before you and I came on the scene.

Arthur Busch 32:52

Yeah, for sure. I just I did a did a podcast with Norm Bryant, and he and he gave me a few lessons in the history.

SPEAKER_01 33:00

Yeah, he's one of my favorite people.

Arthur Busch 33:02

Your interest in young people has has been legendary uh in Flint and in Michigan. Uh, you've been recognized by the State Bar of Michigan for your work with young people, also taking that uh task up every sense, uh, in the legal sense, every since you took the bench way back in, I forgot even what year it was, 93 maybe 91.

SPEAKER_01 33:28

91.

Arthur Busch 33:29

Uh tell us about what you're most recently up to with that and uh especially with the schools.

SPEAKER_01 33:36

Many years ago I got involved in uh truancy issues. Uh, you can't devote a lot of time to it, maybe an hour a week, but uh we've now have an attendance task force in Genesee County from people uh from the social agencies, the schools, and so on and so forth. I've got a couple of specialized courts right now, one of which uh one is uh related to school attendance. Uh, I've got a drug court. I'm in the family division, so we have a number of parents that are petitioned in the court for abuse and neglect, and their primary issue is uh is substance abuse problem. Yeah, I've tried to incorporate uh some new and creative ideas to address some of our social problems that perhaps haven't been looked at uh uh over the years. And so uh I've tried to pass that along to some of my younger judges, and I think uh many of them have gotten a little bit more creative and innovative in terms of addressing uh uh the issues that are going on in today's world. So, yeah, I think I enjoy looking at things and saying, you know something? Why do we do things this way? And is there a better way of doing so? And I think that's what kind of motivates me to try and stay involved and come up with some new thoughts.

Arthur Busch 34:45

Tell us about your program that addresses fathers and their engagement with their families and your your efforts to encourage them to stay engaged with their children.

SPEAKER_01 34:55

Well, it's interesting. I had a law clerk uh several years ago, Tony McDowell, and he and I sat down, we looked at about three or four hundred paternity cases. Now, uh the paternity cases over the last 30 or 40 years have grown just tremendously. Obviously, children born out of wedlock. And I never bought into the term of deadbeat dads, but when we looked at these three or four hundred uh cases, we realized it wasn't any one person's fault, but it was taking well over a year to get a final order. So from the time you begin the case and it has to go to Lansing and all the different uh levels of bureaucracy, I realized that you might have a father out there and a mother, and if they uh have some conflict, the dad won't be able to see this child until there's a court order. So we came up with uh we called it a DAP court, and our whole crusade is to try and track these fathers down. Uh, 95 to 99 percent of them are in our community, and for one reason or another, we haven't done a very good uh job in either getting them served and letting them know how to do it. And when they come in, uh one of the first things we do is uh try and get a genetic test to make sure that he he is the father. We found out about 34 percent of the time from our studies that the individual that the woman has pointed the finger at is not the father. So this is a very complex issue. Bottom line is we're the whole goal or idea is to try and get these families together. We had some pretty good success up until COVID, where we got them counseling, uh, trying to work out something where the dad would be involved as quickly. We were getting many court orders within 60, 90 days of something uh being filed compared to well over a year under the old system. So it took a little bit of satisfaction in knowing we're trying to make a difference, especially with so many kids nowadays in urban communities that are born out of wedlock.

Arthur Busch 36:55

Your program really had two goals. First of all, try to keep the father engaged with their children, which every study's ever been done shows that helps kids to thrive. And your second goal was to see that they financially contribute uh to the child so that they don't end up in poverty. Do you see that program that's taken up by the judges as being something that can be broadened in the Flint community as well as in other places?

SPEAKER_01 37:26

Yeah, like I said, I think uh COVID has slowed things down. Uh, but I think we were having pretty good success of tracking these uh fathers down, getting them getting them involved, helping them perhaps uh uh get some further education or job training so that not only would it help them personally, but also to uh help out in child support if the mother's the custodial parent. Yeah, we we were beginning to make some significant strides, and I think once we get the thank you for joining us at Radio Free Play for this podcast with Duncan M.

Arthur Busch 38:15

Beagle Genesee County Circuit Judge. Part two of this episode will continue next week on February the 8th, 2022, when we release that podcast. Duncan will talk about his illegal beat, his grandfather, in particular, Charles, who was a Genesee County prosecutor in 1929 when the Industrial Union Bank collapsed. The bank collapsed because its officers Charles prosecuted 12 and would embed the depositors' money. The bank was largely owned by Charles Stewart at the time. It's a fascinating story about Flynn history. Duncan also shares his family uh history, uh particularly discusses his mother and other accomplishments of his throughout the years, which I'm sure you'll enjoy. Thank you for joining us again. If you'd like to hear more podcasts, please go to www.radiofreeflint.media. If you'd like to share an idea for an episode or you'd like to appear on Radio Free Flint, please send me an email at art at artbush.com. Thank you for joining us. Have a good day.