Aug. 30, 2022

The 2017 Bishop Airport Terror Attack: Chief Chris Miller Tells the Inside Story

In this episode of Radio Free Flint, retired Public Safety Director Chris Miller recounts one of the most shocking events in Flint’s recent history — the 2017 terrorist attack inside Bishop International Airport.

Miller describes the moment a Tunisian national stabbed an airport police officer and how he and an airport maintenance worker subdued the attacker, ultimately saving the officer’s life. The attacker was later convicted of multiple federal terrorism charges and is serving a life sentence.

Miller also reflects on how 9/11 permanently transformed airport security, including at Bishop Airport, where he led the security detail on September 11, 2001.

Across his nearly 40-year law enforcement career, Miller served with the Genesee County Sheriff’s Department, Mt. Morris Township Police Department, and Bishop Airport Public Safety. He retired in 2021 after receiving the City of Flint Lifetime Achievement Award and a key to the city.

Beyond law enforcement, Miller shares personal stories of growing up in a General Motors family, playing music around Flint, collecting Chevrolet Corvettes, and his experiences in the Flint Community Schools and Mott Community College.

Links Mentioned in This Episode:

Bishop International Airport
🔗 https://www.bishopairport.org/

Profile on Chief Chris Miller – My City Magazine
🔗 https://www.mycitymag.com/a-lifetime-of-service-chief-christopher-miller/

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Chapters

01:42 - Intro and Chief Miller's Background

01:42 - Chief Miller Tells the Story of a Terrorist Attack at Bishop International Airport, Flint, Michigan

05:55 - Terrorist is Arrested and Interrogated

13:17 - Chief Miller's Path to Leading the Airport Public Safety Department

14:56 - 9/11 2001 Terrorist Attacks, Action Taken in Flint to Respond to NYC Terrorism and Changes in Policies and Airport Security and Management

18:25 - Growing up in Flint, Michigan

21:00 - A Short-Lived Musical Career. Chris describes his life as a musician and his band

24:46 - The decision to pursue a career in law enforcement, getting hired by the Genesee County Sheriff's Department and the Bishop International Airport Authority

28:24 - Chris talks about Corvettes and his Collection of Flint, Michigan made cars.

35:13 - Police-Community Relations in Flint, Michigan. Police Misconduct, Doing Policing the Right Way!

36:31 - Chris Miller describes Flint, Michigan and what it means to be a Flintstone.

36:31 - Closing: A Tribute to Flint Police Officer Levester Croslin, Miller's mentor. Final Goodbye to Chris Miller and Best Wishes on a Long and Happy Retirement

Transcript

WEBVTT

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This is Radio Free Flint.

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You're listening to Dr.

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Bush.

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Today I have former public safety chief at Bishop Airport, Christopher Miller.

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Welcome, uh Chief.

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It is very good to see you again.

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Thank you.

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Thank you for having me.

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You're a Flint native.

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You grew up in the area.

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Tell us about your background.

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I'm a product of uh General Motors' parents.

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Uh both my parents worked many, many years for General Motors.

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I grew up on the north end of Flint.

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You know, my dad worked for uh Chevrolet, and my mom worked for uh Fisher Body, the old Turnstead.

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I went to Flint Public Schools, attended Jefferson Elementary School as well as uh Bryant Junior High in Flint Northwestern and my community college and Oakland Community College.

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I uh ended up leaning more toward um music, and I became uh a musician in the Flint area uh before I started my law enforcement career.

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So started off playing uh upright bass, upright bass and uh orchestra at Northwestern.

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I learned how to play uh bass guitar, and I ended up having a high school band, if you will.

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I uh played at all the high schools, uh Flint Northwestern, Northern, Southwestern.

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I don't think we ever played over at Central, but um, I know we did some of the other area schools, you know, where they had dances for the young teenagers.

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That was fun, and that's what I did early on before lunch.

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But something significant happened in your career in uh 2017 that sort of rocked the community, and you were right center of it.

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Absolutely.

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Um, in June 2017, a gentleman by the name of I shouldn't call him a gentleman.

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I I'm sorry, we don't need to mention his name.

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He's had enough.

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Yeah, I I I uh use that term loosely.

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This this person walked into the airport about 8:45, 8:40 a.m.

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He viciously attacked Lieutenant Neville.

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The attack was to the magnitude that it almost cost Lieutenant Neville his life.

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And thank God the people at Hurley Medical Center did one hell of a job taking care of him.

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But not only that, the responding um uh medics that came to his aid within our department, you know, our our guys, and then the Genesee County Sheriff's Department medics and the uh ambulance.

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But I tell you, the agencies that were involved transporting him, you know, I'm talking about the police agencies that shut down every light between Bishop Airport and Hurley Medical Center to make sure that that transport got to the hospital uh as fast as possible.

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Let's step back for just a second.

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You were at work and you were on the second level of the airport.

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There was some kind of commotion.

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Tell us what you saw and what what you did.

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Well, well, at the at the time of the attack, on the day of the attack, we were planning to do some training.

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And the training had to do with contingency plans for anything that would that could or would happen at the airport, such as plane crash, fire, weather emergencies, uh, anything like that.

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We had the FBI, the state police, sheriff's department, and all the other law enforcement uh agencies, as well as fire fire agencies, uh fire department agencies to come to the airport so we could have a round table and talk about these things and um plan for things like this.

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We had a lot of help, needless to say, faster than we would normally have had, just because these people were already uh en route to the airport for a nine o'clock meeting.

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Well, myself and Lieutenant Dan Owen, who was a fire lieutenant, we were um in a conference room and we heard this commotion.

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We looked out the uh glass window and we could see there's a large glass window to this conference room.

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So we could see outside that Lieutenant Neville and uh one of the maintainers, uh Richard Kruell, were um fighting with an individual.

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And so Dan and I ran out to uh give aid, you know, to help.

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By the time we got there, we were all going to the to the floor.

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I don't know why we're fighting with this guy, but obviously um, you know, he he's trying to hurt hurt us because I see this large hunting knife, and then all of a sudden, I'm like, I'm I'm saying to myself, where's all this blood coming from?

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I didn't know if Jeff was had been stabbed or Rich Cruel had been stabbed.

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All I know is just a lot of blood.

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So we're trying to get this guy handcuffed.

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I get my handcuffs out, we get him handcuffed, you know, with the help of the other individuals, including Jeff, I get my handcuffs on him and we pat him down and make sure he doesn't have any other weapons or whatever, and we take him down to lockup in uh in the airport lockup.

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Basically, he attacked Jeff Neville's a lieutenant.

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I come to find out just a few minutes later because as soon as we took him downstairs and got him uh got him in the lockup.

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I came back upstairs because I knew somebody had got hurt, and I knew I had a crime scene, and I had to lock that crime scene down.

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Uh, I get up there, I realize that Jeff has a devastating wound.

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We've got our EMTs coming uh to give aid.

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I think someone from uh one of the restaurant workers uh ran and got a big towel to um put on him to help stop the bleeding.

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We had to lock the airport down.

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I gave orders to lock the airport down uh right away because I didn't know if this guy was by himself or if he had other people with him.

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I immediately recognized him to be an Arab uh of Arab descent.

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Now I'm I'm flashing back to 9-11, some of the other things that have happened in the world.

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It was a difficult day, but we did what we needed to do to keep people safe.

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I mean, you've been a police officer a long time at that point, and I assume having patrolled the streets of Mount Morris Township and some other places, you've encountered unruly people.

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Absolutely.

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He how's this dude rank on the list of yeah?

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He was he was pretty high up there because he he seemed to be running on pure adrenaline.

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Although he wasn't a very large man in stature, he was very, very strong, very powerful, and it took a lot to hold him down and get him handcuffed.

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He fought, you know, he fought to the end, you know, till we actually had him restrained where he couldn't fight anymore.

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The action by you and your fellow officers saved Jeff Neville's life.

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Well, I mean, if it hadn't been that if he hadn't been there that quickly, this might not be the story it is.

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Well, there's some truth to that, but the person who I really want to give the credit to is Richard Cruell.

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What Rich Cruel did that day was awesome.

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He stepped in.

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This is a person who has no police background, no training in hand-to-hand combat, and he had no weapons to defend himself with.

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He's the one that got between this assailant and Jeff and stopped him from injuring Jeff even further because he came from behind and he stabbed Jeff from behind.

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Okay.

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And as he as he went to stab him again, is that is when Richard Cruel threw his arm up and prevented him from stabbing Jeff any further, giving Jeff enough time to react and fight for his life.

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What was uh Rich's uh position with the airport?

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He was a maintainer, a maintenance maintenance worker.

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Eventually, this terrorist, he was a terrorist, make no mistake about this.

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FBI deemed him as a terrorist.

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And his goal was essentially to come to the Flint airport to launch some kind of an attack on the airport.

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Actually, not.

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His his goal was to come to a large airport.

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He did not, through investigation, you know, as the FBI did their interrogation on him, talking to him and finding out why he did what he did, what his intent was, he divulged that he did not realize that the Bishop Airport was as small as it is.

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He thought he was coming to a major airport in Michigan.

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He actually Googled international airports in Michigan.

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And if you Google international airports in Michigan, Bishop, by virtue of alphabetical order, Bishop comes up first, or at least it did at that time.

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That is what he he ended up getting was Bishop Airport.

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And he didn't realize how that it was not the big category X airport until he actually got there.

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But by the time he got there and and um saw what he saw, he says, Well, you know, he's not gonna change his plans now.

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He just do it there.

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Now, this guy came from Canada, as I recall.

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That is correct.

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He came from uh Montreal, Canada, and his goal was to kill as many police officers, airport police officers as he could before he would eventually be killed himself.

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He wanted suicide by police, basically.

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Absolutely.

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That is pretty much what he um he divulged to the FBI.

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He wanted to die, but he wanted to die a martyr, but he wanted to kill some police officers before he died.

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Uh while he was conducting this unprovoked attack on Officer Neville's, he was yelling and screaming, wasn't he?

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Yes, yes, uh, he was.

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You know, death to America.

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He said something about you that killed people in uh Pakistan and Afghanistan and said some other words.

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There was a Flint police captain who was walking in the door of the airport, the front door of the airport, when we were taking this guy down.

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And I told the captain, I said, This guy just attacked Lieutenant Neville.

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I need you to come with me because I'm gonna need your help.

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And so she uh immediately uh followed us.

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We got this guy to the lockup, and I come to find out later that he actually spit, you know, at her.

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His belief was that he he was he was very appalled that we had turned him over to a female police officer.

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He did not recognize this woman as being someone that should be in charge of him or over him.

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And later on in the investigation, I found out that that she she was smart.

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She actually pulled out her cell phone and recorded all the things that he was saying while he was in lockup.

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Things that he was saying to her, the same things that he was saying about you know the USA, some of those things.

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Well, that recording was used in federal court to help convict him.

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So I'm I was very grateful for her help.

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It all came together.

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You know, when you look at that airport and your training, I mean obviously these things go on in other places, but you must have been stunned to see this happen in your hometown in Flint.

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Well, you know, every year, well, let me just back up and say this being a public safety chief at an airport, early on I joined an organization called Aileen.

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Aileen stands for Airport Law Enforcement Agencies Network.

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And that is a group of police chiefs and commanders from all over the country: New York, New Jersey, Chicago, LA, Seattle, you name it, and small airports, uh Charleston, uh, South Carolina, uh, Savannah, Georgia.

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Savannah is not much bigger than our airport.

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It doesn't matter how large or how small the airport is, if you have um general aviation security, if you have aviation at your airport, you know, commercial aviation, that's the word I'm looking for.

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If you have commercial aviation at your airport, um, you're in charge of people getting on aircraft, traveling from point A to point B and back to point A, and you want to keep them people, those people uh as safe as possible.

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So in this organization, we get together, we talk about how to do that because it can happen at any airport.

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I I met a good friend of mine, he was the chief at LAX, and he told me, he put me off to the side, and he says, Chris, the thing you you need to remember is that it doesn't matter how large or how small you are, it's not a matter of if, it's a matter of when.

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It can happen, he says, just just because you're from a small airport doesn't mean it can't happen to you.

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And he told me about that.

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I mean, he he made that statement to me just a few years before we got attacked in uh 2017, because LAX had been had been attacked.

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You know, they had had an active shooter at LAX where a uh TSA agent had been uh killed.

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And so he told me, he says it's not a matter of if it's a matter of when.

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Obviously, that's an experience that's indelibly written in your minds and those of many of you worked at the airport for 10 years, and the airport at that time had gone through a lot of changes in the 90s, it had become essentially a brand new airport.

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It was rebuilt.

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There's a lot of support for it in the community.

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That airport then met with not just physical changes but some major changes uh in 2000.

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Tell us the story of how you got to be the public safety chief at Bishop Airport.

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Yes.

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Well, like I said, I started there in 1989.

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Jim Rice, who was the uh director at the airport, decided to put out a search for a new chief.

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And I came to work on Thursday one night, and one of the guys who I had known quite a quite a while, he said to me, He says, Um, did you see this?

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And it was a posting for the the position.

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And I said, uh, no, I hadn't seen that.

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He says, um, he said, you should put in for this.

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And I looked at him, I says, Why me?

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And he says, because I can work for you.

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He says, Um, you've always been a good leader.

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I can work for you.

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We can work for you.

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That inspired me.

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I went home and taught my wife about it, and she said, Absolutely, let's uh let's put together a resume.

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And we did.

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And I want to say they had about 29 applicants, including myself, for the position.

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And I ended up coming out number one.

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That is how I became the public safety chief.

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And at the time, I was an EMT, I was a certified police officer, but I was not a firefighter.

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I didn't know a whole lot about firefighting.

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So immediately I threw myself into learning what firefighters do and what that was all about.

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Now in 2000, something pretty significant happened.

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Well, 9-11 happened.

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And you want to you want to talk about 2001.

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Yeah, in 2001.

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A little more than a year after I became the chief, 9-11 hit.

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And boy, was that a day.

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I don't think there's any American that can say they didn't know where they were or what they were doing when they found out about um those towers getting struck and the uh the country being attacked.

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I know what I was doing.

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I know exactly what I was doing, I know exactly where I was.

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Where were you and what were you doing?

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I I was sitting at my desk doing paperwork.

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I was I was at the airport in my office doing paperwork, going over my dailies from the day before, you know, the daily reports from the officers and just uh typical routine stuff.

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I got a phone call and uh it was from um Jeff Neville, who later on became my lieutenant.

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Jeff Neville called me, he says, Chief, he says, uh, you need to get to a television.

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I said, Why?

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What's going on?

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He says, You need to get to a television right now.

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So I I jump up out of my office and I step into the um administrative office uh at the airport, you know, just outside my office, and there's nobody in the administration.

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I'm like, where's everybody at?

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And they're all in the conference room.

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And as soon as I walked in, that's when the second plane struck.

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The second aircraft struck the um the second tower in New York City.

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In New York City.

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Everybody was trying to figure out what was going on.

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People were thinking that it was just an accident until the second aircraft hit.

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When the second aircraft hit, okay, that this can't be just an accident.

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I I don't think it was um within two minutes later, you know, my cell phone started jumping off the hook, and it was the federal government calling me and telling me, Chief, shut it down, shut the airport down, shut everything down.

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Nothing go comes in, nothing goes out.

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Shut your airspace down, shut all aircraft down, go through your airport with a fine-toothed comb.

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We're sending people.

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It was less than 30 minutes.

00:16:56.240 --> 00:16:59.279
Um, I want to say less than less than 20 minutes.

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The state police was right there at the airport.

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Grand Plank Township showed up, Flint City showed up, the sheriff's department was there, Burton PD.

00:17:07.759 --> 00:17:08.480
We had it all.

00:17:08.640 --> 00:17:11.920
We locked the airport down, we went through it with a fine-toothed comb.

00:17:12.079 --> 00:17:21.359
We went through uh all the aircraft that were on the ground to make sure that no incendiary devices or bombs, if you will, were already planted on any of our aircraft.

00:17:21.519 --> 00:17:23.839
We did everything to make that airport safe.

00:17:24.079 --> 00:17:28.799
We uh followed all the security measures that the uh federal government asked us to do.

00:17:29.519 --> 00:17:36.160
Now, after that, there were quite a bit of changes in the way people general aviation uh was pretty much shut down for a while.

00:17:36.240 --> 00:17:44.799
But it uh once it got back to to somewhat normal, if it was normal, there were a lot of changes that took place at the airport.

00:17:45.119 --> 00:17:45.680
Absolutely.

00:17:45.839 --> 00:17:52.240
The first big change came was that the FAA was no longer in charge of aviation security.

00:17:52.319 --> 00:18:06.079
Um, the newly created uh Transportation Security Administration, or as people know it, uh TSA, they became the security entity governing all airports throughout the um continental USA.

00:18:06.559 --> 00:18:19.680
We took our marching orders from them in reference to how we uh implemented the different security measures throughout the whole facility and the land, the property.

00:18:20.000 --> 00:18:24.559
You adjusted to this new reality, which continued to this day, actually.

00:18:24.799 --> 00:18:26.640
What part of town did you grow up in?

00:18:26.880 --> 00:18:35.599
The the north end, uh between Pearson, uh just south of Pearson Road, and I lived there my um my entire childhood.

00:18:35.839 --> 00:18:38.640
We were a steadfast family.

00:18:38.799 --> 00:18:42.799
We stayed there, and my family owned property there.

00:18:42.880 --> 00:18:45.599
I want to say my dad had three houses in a row right there.

00:18:45.680 --> 00:18:49.119
He had the one that we lived in, and then he had two rental houses next door.

00:18:49.680 --> 00:18:51.119
What kind of neighborhood was it?

00:18:51.359 --> 00:18:54.640
It was your typical General Motors family.

00:18:54.799 --> 00:19:05.039
Most of all the parents worked for General Motors, and we were probably the smallest family on the block uh because it was just two of us, my brother and I.

00:19:05.119 --> 00:19:12.319
But all the other kids that we grew up with had five, six, seven, eight, and nine kids to their family.

00:19:12.480 --> 00:19:18.160
Again, we were one of the smaller families uh in the neighborhood, but we were um we were well known.

00:19:18.400 --> 00:19:20.720
We were stable in the community.

00:19:20.960 --> 00:19:30.160
I not I not only had my mom and dad as as parents, but all of the families there were your parents, so to speak.

00:19:30.400 --> 00:19:44.880
Because in my day, if you were up the street and you were cutting up and doing something you weren't supposed to, those families, the mother, father, whichever saw you doing wrong, doing something that you had no business doing, they would get after you.

00:19:45.039 --> 00:19:49.519
You get smacked on the butt, and then they take you home and tell your parents, and then you got it again.

00:19:49.680 --> 00:20:07.519
You know, as I grew up with that mentality, that kept me, as I continued to you know, grow, it kept me out of trouble because the first thing I thought about when Whenever I thought about doing something that I had no business doing, you know, what would my dad say, or what would my mother say?

00:20:07.599 --> 00:20:10.480
You know, what were they gonna do to me if they found out?

00:20:10.720 --> 00:20:12.799
Is that different today than it was then?

00:20:13.119 --> 00:20:13.759
I think so.

00:20:13.920 --> 00:20:25.839
I now this is just my opinion, but I don't think that people have or parents has have as much control over their kids as my parents, my generation did.

00:20:26.160 --> 00:20:35.359
Because again, if my dad caught one of my buddies from another family across the street or up to up the street or down the street, whatever.

00:20:35.519 --> 00:20:44.079
If I mean if they were doing something, something mischievous, if they saw you doing something you weren't supposed to be doing, they would say something and they would get after you.

00:20:44.240 --> 00:20:49.200
You know, nowadays, I don't think you know, parents communicate as well as they did back then.

00:20:49.599 --> 00:20:51.119
Between one another, you mean?

00:20:51.359 --> 00:20:58.880
Yeah, you know, and every everybody knew each other, all the families knew each other, and all the families were uh they had a relationship.

00:20:59.200 --> 00:21:07.519
You uh made your way into mock college, but before that you took a spin as a as a musician.

00:21:07.759 --> 00:21:08.079
Yes.

00:21:08.319 --> 00:21:10.720
Well, was what kind of music were you playing?

00:21:10.960 --> 00:21:20.640
Mostly, mostly RB, but there was some times that we were called to play polka and we were called to play uh country and western because it all depends on the gig.

00:21:20.799 --> 00:21:25.839
To us, it didn't matter because we were true music musicians and we could play anything.

00:21:26.079 --> 00:21:27.200
Do you still play?

00:21:27.440 --> 00:21:36.640
I don't know if you could see it in the background, but there's I have uh a bass guitar that I bought way back in 1976, and I I still have that.

00:21:36.799 --> 00:21:39.440
I have a number of uh bass guitars.

00:21:39.599 --> 00:21:41.599
I still play and I sing a little bit.

00:21:41.759 --> 00:21:46.799
Right now I'm currently not playing with any band or anything, um, but I have done that over the years.

00:21:46.960 --> 00:21:54.480
I made my living from 18 to uh I want to say 24 years old playing music.

00:21:54.640 --> 00:21:57.279
I I had little odd jobs, you know.

00:21:57.359 --> 00:22:00.559
I um at 18 years old, I worked for Hank Graft.

00:22:00.640 --> 00:22:04.640
You know, when Hank Graft uh Ford was downtown, a lot of people may not remember that.

00:22:04.960 --> 00:22:07.759
Uh I I do because they sponsored our baseball team.

00:22:07.920 --> 00:22:09.680
My first baseball team was Otto P.

00:22:09.839 --> 00:22:10.240
Graft.

00:22:10.480 --> 00:22:19.599
I met Hank by playing music because Hank and his wife uh Bonnie, they uh were um involved with uh what they call junior achievement back then.

00:22:19.839 --> 00:22:23.920
They would have these parties and they would need live entertainment.

00:22:24.079 --> 00:22:26.160
And somebody told them about us.

00:22:26.319 --> 00:22:35.440
They came up on the north end to see us uh play, you know, to see if we uh were actually good enough to do what they wanted us to do.

00:22:35.599 --> 00:22:37.599
And right on the spot, they hired us.

00:22:37.839 --> 00:22:42.880
We played uh parties for them for uh a couple of years, you know, on and off.

00:22:43.039 --> 00:22:46.559
I remember there was a guy in Flint by the name of Jack Hurlick.

00:22:46.720 --> 00:22:49.519
He was owner of all the Hurlick's drugstores.

00:22:49.680 --> 00:22:57.920
Jack came to one of the parties, and it was a black tie party, and we were in tuxedos and everything, and he walked up to us and he says, You guys are really good.

00:22:58.079 --> 00:22:59.119
He says, Oh my god.

00:22:59.200 --> 00:23:03.759
He says, Where he says, Where, where he says, Hey, where'd you get these guys from?

00:23:05.440 --> 00:23:15.759
His wife was well known in Flint as a being a jazz uh aficionado, and she actually bought a building, uh the old peppermill, and turned it into a jazz club.

00:23:15.920 --> 00:23:16.480
Yeah, yeah.

00:23:16.559 --> 00:23:22.559
I think we uh even played um a few jazz songs uh that night for her.

00:23:22.640 --> 00:23:25.519
I remember we played uh The Girl from Empanema.

00:23:25.680 --> 00:23:27.359
That was an old jazz tune.

00:23:27.440 --> 00:23:36.960
Uh, and she wanted uh to hear us play, you know, because we were playing, you know, rock and roll and RB and just music to for people to dance to.

00:23:37.119 --> 00:23:44.240
Like you said, she was a jazz musician, or she she loved jazz, and she wanted to hear something that night, and we accommodated her.

00:23:44.480 --> 00:23:45.920
What was the name of the band?

00:23:46.240 --> 00:23:52.160
The band was actually uh it was a weird name, but it it actually caught on.

00:23:52.319 --> 00:23:54.640
It was made up of all of our names.

00:23:54.799 --> 00:23:58.079
Uh, the leader of our band, his name was John McCowan.

00:23:58.400 --> 00:24:03.680
John, Chris, Chuck, Lindsay, and Bernard, we were JCCLB movement.

00:24:04.000 --> 00:24:09.440
That name became infamous in the black community in Flint.

00:24:09.519 --> 00:24:22.720
And even, you know, before I got into law enforcement, I want to say in 1976, 75, 76, 77, we made really good money supporting ourselves as musicians.

00:24:23.039 --> 00:24:28.880
I would have a day job, but I made more money playing music than I did on my day job.

00:24:28.960 --> 00:24:33.920
And matter of fact, there was times when I would say, Hey, I got enough of this daytime stuff.

00:24:34.000 --> 00:24:35.200
I'm I'm doing music.

00:24:35.440 --> 00:24:46.720
As the 70s came to a close, the disco era kicked in, live entertainment began to die, and the DJ era became more prevalent.

00:24:47.039 --> 00:24:52.480
About that time, you met somebody who was working these in these joints where you were playing.

00:24:52.640 --> 00:24:57.759
Tell us about that person who had was somebody that had a hell of an influence on your life.

00:24:58.000 --> 00:24:58.960
Absolutely absolutely.

00:24:59.279 --> 00:25:11.680
Um, we were doing gigs at the old IMA auditorium downtown Flint, the bowler's ball, the Cotilian ball, things like that, and even some of the nightclubs that we played around in Flint.

00:25:11.920 --> 00:25:15.359
There was this guy that I used to always see him.

00:25:15.519 --> 00:25:18.640
And to come to find out he was a Flint police officer.

00:25:18.799 --> 00:25:21.759
And and I'm like, okay, why is this guy always hanging out?

00:25:21.920 --> 00:25:23.119
Come to find out he's security.

00:25:23.200 --> 00:25:28.079
He was working security, and he was like with doing what they call moonlighting, if you will.

00:25:28.319 --> 00:25:30.000
We got to know each other pretty good.

00:25:30.079 --> 00:25:34.079
And he would always come up to me and he'd say, Miller, when you come down to the police department.

00:25:34.240 --> 00:25:35.279
I'm like, huh?

00:25:35.440 --> 00:25:39.440
He says, when you come down to the police department, he says, you got to come join the police department.

00:25:39.519 --> 00:25:41.200
Come join, come, come join with us.

00:25:41.359 --> 00:25:43.599
And I looked at him and I cocked my head to the side.

00:25:43.680 --> 00:25:44.880
I says, You must be nuts.

00:25:45.119 --> 00:25:49.440
I says, I have no aspiration of being a cop.

00:25:49.680 --> 00:25:53.200
And he says, Man, I'm telling you, it's a great job.

00:25:53.359 --> 00:25:54.880
You know, you get to help people.

00:25:55.039 --> 00:26:00.480
Along with that, it's good pay, good benefits, and you'll have a retirement when it's all said and done.

00:26:00.640 --> 00:26:04.640
And all that sounded great, but as really not what I wanted to do.

00:26:04.720 --> 00:26:06.160
You know, I had it in my head.

00:26:06.240 --> 00:26:07.599
I wanted to be a rock star.

00:26:09.119 --> 00:26:11.839
Well, the good Lord uh had other plans for me.

00:26:11.920 --> 00:26:14.799
So by the way, that officer's name was Levester Cross.

00:26:14.880 --> 00:26:16.880
God rest his soul, he's passed away now.

00:26:17.119 --> 00:26:20.880
He went on to work for Flint PD for well over 30 years.

00:26:21.359 --> 00:26:24.880
Much respected officer uh in this community.

00:26:25.039 --> 00:26:31.119
Um, it wasn't very many people that didn't know Levester Croslin or Lee Croslin, as a lot of people called him.

00:26:31.359 --> 00:26:33.119
He finally talked me into it.

00:26:33.279 --> 00:26:40.000
By the time I got ready to join the Flint Police Department, that's when they had a big layoff, and I want to say 1980.

00:26:40.079 --> 00:26:45.920
You know, and I was going to school back and forth, you know, and I tried to join them, but again, they had this layoff.

00:26:46.000 --> 00:26:49.359
So he's the one that said, hey, the sheriff's department is hiring.

00:26:49.519 --> 00:26:57.039
I went over to the sheriff's department, they directed me to administration, I want to say personnel, over in the county administration building.

00:26:57.200 --> 00:26:59.519
And that is where I put in my application.

00:26:59.680 --> 00:27:04.480
I met a guy down there by the name of Captain Jack Spaulding, who took a liking to me.

00:27:04.559 --> 00:27:11.039
And Jack Spaulding said, um, he looked at his uh top lieutenant, I think his name was Dana Berry at that time.

00:27:11.200 --> 00:27:14.079
He looked at Dana and he says, uh, he says, I like this young man.

00:27:14.240 --> 00:27:19.039
He says, um, if he's got no record, he's not, you know, hasn't been in any trouble or anything.

00:27:19.119 --> 00:27:20.880
He says, I want to get this guy hired.

00:27:21.119 --> 00:27:24.079
And that is how I got into the sheriff's department.

00:27:24.400 --> 00:27:26.720
And when I started, John O'Brien was the sheriff.

00:27:26.880 --> 00:27:28.880
And then later you worked for Sheriff Joe.

00:27:29.039 --> 00:27:30.720
Sheriff Joe was yes.

00:27:30.799 --> 00:27:37.359
Uh John O'Brien stuck around for about another year uh after I hired in, and then uh he didn't run again.

00:27:37.440 --> 00:27:44.640
And uh Joe Wilson ran for sheriff and became the sheriff, and that is who I spent most of my career under Joe Wilson.

00:27:44.880 --> 00:27:49.839
So it was 1982 when you started with the sheriff's department, right?

00:27:50.079 --> 00:27:50.480
Yep.

00:27:50.640 --> 00:27:52.160
I retired in 2000.

00:27:52.400 --> 00:27:52.720
Yep.

00:27:52.880 --> 00:28:00.240
So you worked the Township Police Department in Mount Morris, yeah, and that gig lasted quite a number of years as well, didn't just a few years.

00:28:00.400 --> 00:28:04.880
I think I worked there from uh 1986 to 1989.

00:28:05.200 --> 00:28:08.960
And then you worked for uh Bishop Airport for a long time.

00:28:09.920 --> 00:28:10.480
Right, right.

00:28:10.559 --> 00:28:17.279
I left Mount Morris Township to go work for uh Chief Mike Ahern at uh at Bishop Airport.

00:28:17.359 --> 00:28:23.599
He had started a brand new police department there, and he asked me to come on work part-time for him.

00:28:23.839 --> 00:28:27.599
Let's switch gears here for a second uh while we've got a few minutes left.

00:28:27.759 --> 00:28:34.000
One of the things that I learned about you in preparing for this podcast was that you like Corvettes.

00:28:34.319 --> 00:28:35.519
Absolutely.

00:28:36.000 --> 00:28:38.480
I am uh where does that come from?

00:28:38.720 --> 00:28:40.160
I've always liked cars.

00:28:40.559 --> 00:28:41.920
Is that because you're from Flint?

00:28:42.319 --> 00:28:47.519
Uh, probably, you know, because some of the world's best cars came out of Flint, Michigan.

00:28:47.839 --> 00:28:53.200
For those who don't know, uh the Corvette was born in Flint, Michigan in 1953.

00:28:53.440 --> 00:28:57.920
It came out of uh what is now uh truck and bus over in Van Slate.

00:28:58.160 --> 00:29:00.000
That's where the first Corvette was born.

00:29:00.240 --> 00:29:09.519
Some years, a year or two later, I I don't know exactly when, but uh at some point um the the manufacturing went down to uh bowling green.

00:29:09.759 --> 00:29:11.599
That's Kentucky, not Ohio.

00:29:11.839 --> 00:29:12.720
Yes, yep.

00:29:12.880 --> 00:29:15.119
Yes, I am a big Corvette enthusiast.

00:29:15.279 --> 00:29:16.400
I own two of them.

00:29:16.559 --> 00:29:24.160
Uh yeah, I own I own uh a 2004 convertible and I own a 2017 uh C7 Grand Sport.

00:29:24.319 --> 00:29:26.319
I'm a part of a Corvette group.

00:29:26.480 --> 00:29:32.720
The my name of my Corvette group is um Corvettes of Distinction, or as we like to call it, the COD.

00:29:33.119 --> 00:29:42.480
And we have about 14 members um with various cars ranging back to uh 1989 all the way up to a 2021.

00:29:42.880 --> 00:29:51.440
Playing a role with this group is is essentially its leader and back to the bricks and and creating a Corvette reunion at one point.

00:29:51.680 --> 00:29:51.920
Right.

00:29:52.079 --> 00:29:58.319
Well, I I am the vice president of COD, but I'm also a member along with my president.

00:29:58.480 --> 00:30:01.359
I'm a member of the Corvette reunion.

00:30:01.519 --> 00:30:05.200
I'm on the committee for the Corvette Reunion with uh Gary Drago.

00:30:05.440 --> 00:30:07.200
Uh-huh, of Southwestern.

00:30:07.440 --> 00:30:07.599
Right.

00:30:07.680 --> 00:30:13.599
Gary Drago is the president of the uh Corvette Reunion, and we are uh committee members.

00:30:13.759 --> 00:30:17.839
I I understand that there were quite a few Corvettes that went to the reunion.

00:30:18.079 --> 00:30:23.759
Every year we get an average of about 500 Corvettes downtown Flint.

00:30:24.079 --> 00:30:26.720
You must be in heaven when you see all those Corvettes.

00:30:26.960 --> 00:30:31.839
Oh my God, everything from a 53 all the way up to the the latest model.

00:30:32.000 --> 00:30:35.440
And for those that don't know, Corvettes are done in generations.

00:30:35.599 --> 00:30:43.839
You have a C1, which which represents the first generation Corvettes from 1953 to 1962.

00:30:44.079 --> 00:30:56.079
And then um 63, which is one of the most expensive Corvettes you'll ever find, because if you find one of those in uh mint condition, the 63 is the only one that they made with the split window.

00:30:56.240 --> 00:31:00.559
That car is well over six figures if it is in mint condition.

00:31:00.720 --> 00:31:07.440
But then you go on all the way through the C1, C2, C3, and all the way up to what is called now the C8.

00:31:07.759 --> 00:31:13.279
That's the latest Corvette that uh that body style was created um in 2020.

00:31:14.000 --> 00:31:22.000
You also have been uh involved in police community relations activities throughout your career.

00:31:22.240 --> 00:31:28.319
You're a sound, steady fella from the city who's done some amazing things in your career.

00:31:28.480 --> 00:31:40.640
We I think you're qualified to tell us with some authority what's your assessment of police community relations in Flint and Genesee County, or as I like to call it, the Flint area.

00:31:41.039 --> 00:31:48.799
Are you are you asking as a relationship with the the community itself or the law enforcement agencies with with one another?

00:31:49.039 --> 00:31:53.359
No, I they have to be, they have to get along with each other.

00:31:53.599 --> 00:31:56.799
I'm talking about the community and the police.

00:31:57.039 --> 00:31:59.279
Well, what what is the status of?

00:31:59.359 --> 00:32:01.920
I mean, what do you think the state of it is today?

00:32:02.000 --> 00:32:07.839
I mean, we we see things on television, we read things in newspapers, we watch movies.

00:32:08.000 --> 00:32:10.559
What's what's what's real life out there today?

00:32:10.640 --> 00:32:14.400
I mean, what is it that you look at Flint with all of its issues?

00:32:14.640 --> 00:32:24.240
We seem to be a city that, although we have had some problems here and there between citizens and police, most of our problems seem to be worked out pretty well.

00:32:24.400 --> 00:32:26.160
Looking at it objectively.

00:32:26.480 --> 00:32:37.839
My opinion is that we have a dynamic sheriff in Chris Swanson, and we have a dynamic police chief in Terrence Green, both of whom I've worked with, I go way back with.

00:32:38.079 --> 00:32:44.240
For those of you who don't know, Terrence Green came from the Genesee County Sheriff's Department.

00:32:44.480 --> 00:32:51.759
And I remember Chris Swanson when he hired on as a young deputy and watched him rise within the uh sheriff's department.

00:32:51.839 --> 00:32:53.920
So I I go way back with both of them.

00:32:54.240 --> 00:32:58.160
I know that they care about this community um very much.

00:32:58.400 --> 00:33:01.440
They want to see the best for Flint in Genesee County.

00:33:01.519 --> 00:33:05.839
And I think that they're doing the best that they can with what they have to work with.

00:33:06.000 --> 00:33:08.319
The community, you know, it's tough.

00:33:08.480 --> 00:33:10.640
You know, I'm I'm an African American.

00:33:11.039 --> 00:33:12.960
I understand both sides.

00:33:13.200 --> 00:33:28.640
I understand the fear that people uh have of the police, especially when you see things that happen to young African Americans, particularly males, and you see people being shot, you know, and killed.

00:33:28.799 --> 00:33:30.319
And here's what I say.

00:33:30.480 --> 00:33:35.039
When when I did it, I I did my best to treat everyone with respect.

00:33:35.279 --> 00:33:38.480
Because I feel like if I gave respect, I would get respect.

00:33:38.640 --> 00:33:40.799
And in in in most cases, I did.

00:33:40.960 --> 00:33:48.079